t8769

Here's an excellent scam that's earning this company a lot of money,
I'm sure. They managed to rip me off £125, and I'm just warning
others.

I wrote to this company to cancel my account at the end of 1 year.

The operator confirmed my account wsa closed, but asked if I'd like a
PAC code, saying it would cancel after 1 month. I said that would be
fine, I was thinking of keeping the number.

What she didn't tell me, and what this company didn't tell me was that
my account would be kept open even if I didn't use the PAC code and my
account would still be debited every month. Even thoug I'd confirmed
with them that it would close.


So here's the scam.


They told me it would remain open, but only in a text message, hidden
under Pac code information.

Of course I didn't realise there was information changing my account
in this text, and they made an easy £125 by tricking me into keeping
my account open when I'd asked for it to be closed.


This nice little earner probably makes lots of money for CPW.


They're leagally covered, because techinally they did tell me, but
they did it in such a dishonest, sneaky, difficult way, that I (and
I'm sure lots of others) did not realise.


Its pure dishonesty and I'm sure illegal, but who's going to go to
court over a small amount.




They even charged me for insurance I hadn't asked for.. a bunch of
theiving wankers.

Martin Jay

On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 07:47:32 -0800 (PST), t8769 <tf19@hotmail.com>
wrote:
>Here's an excellent scam that's earning this company a lot of money,
>I'm sure. They managed to rip me off £125, and I'm just warning
>others.
>
>I wrote to this company to cancel my account at the end of 1 year.
>
>The operator confirmed my account wsa closed, but asked if I'd like a
>PAC code, saying it would cancel after 1 month. I said that would be
>fine, I was thinking of keeping the number.
>
>What she didn't tell me, and what this company didn't tell me was that
>my account would be kept open even if I didn't use the PAC code and my
>account would still be debited every month. Even thoug I'd confirmed
>with them that it would close.
>
>
>So here's the scam.
>
>
>They told me it would remain open, but only in a text message, hidden
>under Pac code information.
>
>Of course I didn't realise there was information changing my account
>in this text, and they made an easy £125 by tricking me into keeping
>my account open when I'd asked for it to be closed.
>
>
>This nice little earner probably makes lots of money for CPW.
>
>
>They're leagally covered, because techinally they did tell me, but
>they did it in such a dishonest, sneaky, difficult way, that I (and
>I'm sure lots of others) did not realise.

This has been mentioned here before.

However, legally I think you have a point and you should refuse to pay
the bill, or demand a refund if you paid by automatic electronic
means. If you've paid by direct debit I suggest you contact your bank
and request a refund under the Direct Debit guarantee scheme.

I think the fact that you wrote to CPW canceling your account
demonstrates that you wanted to end the contract between you and them.

For them to inform you by text message AFTER your conversation that if
you didn't use the PAC your account would remain open is very
underhanded, and in doing so it appears they have unilaterally
extended the contract. Contracts don't work like that. Both sides
have be aware of what they're doing.

HOWEVER, they may have covered their slight of hand in your contract's
original terms and conditions.
--
Martin Jay

Lobster

t8769 wrote:

> Of course I didn't realise there was information changing my account
> in this text, and they made an easy £125 by tricking me into keeping
> my account open when I'd asked for it to be closed.

How long did it take for you to realise the accout hadn't closed? Sounds
lot a lot of money...

David

Gavin

On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 07:47:32 -0800 (PST), t8769 <tf19@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>Here's an excellent scam that's earning this company a lot of money,
>I'm sure. They managed to rip me off £125, and I'm just warning
>others.
>


Hardly specific to them, it would be the same with any mobile
operator, in order for you to use a PAC code the old account has to
stay active, if the account is closed before a PAC is used it won't
work and you lose the number.

Maybe they weren't clear but they were doing the right thing to make
your life easier. I suspect they were refering to the PAC being Valid
a month, and you didn't realise and thought it meant the account. As
you wated a PAC you agreed to not closing the account (so the PAC
could work)

xpuser

"t8769" <tf19@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:75300ce6-3146-405e-a64e-d986ca92e790@p69g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
Here's an excellent scam that's earning this company a lot of money,
I'm sure. They managed to rip me off £125, and I'm just warning
others.

I wrote to this company to cancel my account at the end of 1 year.

The operator confirmed my account wsa closed, but asked if I'd like a
PAC code, saying it would cancel after 1 month. I said that would be
fine, I was thinking of keeping the number.

What she didn't tell me, and what this company didn't tell me was that
my account would be kept open even if I didn't use the PAC code and my
account would still be debited every month. Even thoug I'd confirmed
with them that it would close.


So here's the scam.


They told me it would remain open, but only in a text message, hidden
under Pac code information.

Of course I didn't realise there was information changing my account
in this text, and they made an easy £125 by tricking me into keeping
my account open when I'd asked for it to be closed.


This nice little earner probably makes lots of money for CPW.


They're leagally covered, because techinally they did tell me, but
they did it in such a dishonest, sneaky, difficult way, that I (and
I'm sure lots of others) did not realise.


Its pure dishonesty and I'm sure illegal, but who's going to go to
court over a small amount.




They even charged me for insurance I hadn't asked for.. a bunch of
theiving wankers.


Not sure you have a case here. They told you the account would stay open
in the the text they sent you. This is what they would aregue if you went
to court. I agree it is under-handed, but they did inform you your accoutn
would stay open.

Woby Tide

On Nov 22, 3:47 pm, t8769 <t...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Here's an excellent scam that's earning this company a lot of money,
> I'm sure. They managed to rip me off £125, and I'm just warning
> others.
>
> I wrote to this company to cancel my account at the end of 1 year.
>
> The operator confirmed my account wsa closed, but asked if I'd like a
> PAC code, saying it would cancel after 1 month. I said that would be
> fine, I was thinking of keeping the number.

so conversely, if they had cancelled the contract this topic would now
be "O2 stole my number even though I told them I wanted to keep it"

David Hearn

t8769 wrote:
> Here's an excellent scam that's earning this company a lot of money,
> I'm sure. They managed to rip me off £125, and I'm just warning
> others.
>
> I wrote to this company to cancel my account at the end of 1 year.
>
> The operator confirmed my account wsa closed, but asked if I'd like a
> PAC code, saying it would cancel after 1 month. I said that would be
> fine, I was thinking of keeping the number.

Aha, that's your problem. Ofcom states that requesting a PAC will
supercede and cancel all other requests to terminate an account.

> What she didn't tell me, and what this company didn't tell me was that
> my account would be kept open even if I didn't use the PAC code and my
> account would still be debited every month. Even thoug I'd confirmed
> with them that it would close.

Yes, that's perfectly normal. A PAC is valid for 30 days, after which
if it hasn't been used to tranfer the number it just expires and
everything returns to normal - no transfer, no cancellation.

> So here's the scam.
>
>
> They told me it would remain open, but only in a text message, hidden
> under Pac code information.

Incidentally, how did they provide you with the PAC? Sounds like they
texted it to you? They're also required to provide written confirmation
of the PAC, and how it works, to be sent within 2 days of the PAC being
requested. I expect you would have received that letter.

If they texted it to you, seems a bit strange that in the same medium
they sent the PAC (possibly same message) they explained how the PAC
worked, and the side effects of not using it. If delivering a PAC is
valid via text, then surely the T&C's regardin that PAC is also valid.

As I said, you should also have received a written copy of the PAC and
other details.

> Of course I didn't realise there was information changing my account
> in this text, and they made an easy £125 by tricking me into keeping
> my account open when I'd asked for it to be closed.

£125 - either you were on a very high value tarrif (couple of months),
or you fail to monitor your bank accounts sufficiently (quite a few
months). Either way, you should have noticed things earlier. Lets just
hope you're not claiming Child Benefit


> This nice little earner probably makes lots of money for CPW.
>
>
> They're leagally covered, because techinally they did tell me, but
> they did it in such a dishonest, sneaky, difficult way, that I (and
> I'm sure lots of others) did not realise.

Legally covered - so they did nothing illegal then.

> Its pure dishonesty and I'm sure illegal, but who's going to go to
> court over a small amount.

Oh, now it's illegal. What changed in those 2 lines?

> They even charged me for insurance I hadn't asked for..

I very much doubt they started insurance at the point of asking for a
PAC, so I suspect you're complaining that the £125 included insurance
payments that continued.

D

pjlusenet@yahoo.co.uk

Have you complained to them?

I've found OSPS and CPW willing to correct mistakes.

t8769

Yes I called them

I told them that they hadn't explained to me that they were going to
keep my account over.

I explained that I had told them to close this account, and if they
wanted to keep it open, they should have made this clear to me.

They refused to budge, made some pathetic excuses, and refunded a
little money, but they get to keep most of it.



I am sure tens of thousands of people get caught out by this scam, and
this nets CarphoneWarehouse lots of cash.


Its a great little scam, I know I'm not the only person to be fleeced,
and I hope Mr Dunstone and CPW staff feel good stealing people's
money.


A contract is not legal if the requirements have been hidden or made
in a misleading way. Sending notification hidden at the bottom of a
text, which I would have to scroll down to find, is misleading and
obviously illegal. But they know I'm not going to take them to court
over £125.



I am rather suspicious of the above messages defending this scam, and
wonder if Mr Dunstone's staff are writing emails to defend his
dishonest and illgal scams. What kind of person would defend dishonest
business practices.


Well.. in future I'll remember to stop DirectDebits at the bank, but I
assumed Mr Dunstone's company was a reasonably honest company, and did
not expect them to be stealing from customers like this.

t8769

PS


Despite the rather bizzare defence of CPW's scam by David Hearn


Yes

They did actually sign me up for monthly phone insurance, even though
I'd called them, and written to say I did not want it.


CarphoneWarehouse, really are a bunch of theives, liars and scammers.